Monday, 7 December 2009

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7 December 2009  Article Rating

While a shadow minister, Tony Abbott was never afraid of speaking bluntly in a manner that was at odds with Coalition policy.

So as I am a humble backbencher I am sure he won't complain if I tell a few home truths about the farce that the Coalition's policy, or lack of policy, on climate change has descended into.

First, let's get this straight. You cannot cut emissions without a cost. To replace dirty coal fired power stations with cleaner gas fired ones, or renewables like wind let alone nuclear power or even coal fired power with carbon capture and storage is all going to cost money.

To get farmers to change the way they manage their land, or plant trees and vegetation all costs money.

Somebody has to pay.

So any suggestion that you can dramatically cut emissions without any cost is, to use a favourite term of Mr Abbott, "bullshit." Moreover he knows it.

The whole argument for an emissions trading scheme as opposed to cutting emissions via a carbon tax or simply by regulation is that it is cheaper - in other words, electricity prices will rise by less to achieve the same level of emission reductions.

The term you will see used for this is "least cost abatement".

It is not possible to criticise the new Coalition policy on climate change because it does not exist. Mr Abbott apparently knows what he is against, but not what he is for.

Second, as we are being blunt, the fact is that Tony and the people who put him in his job do not want to do anything about climate change. They do not believe in human caused global warming. As Tony observed on one occasion "climate change is crap" or if you consider his mentor, Senator Minchin, the world is not warming, it's cooling and the climate change issue is part of a vast left wing conspiracy to deindustrialise the world.

Now politics is about conviction and a commitment to carry out those convictions. The Liberal Party is currently led by people whose conviction on climate change is that it is "crap" and you don't need to do anything about it. Any policy that is announced will simply be a con, an environmental figleaf to cover a determination to do nothing. After all, as Nick Minchin observed, in his view the majority of the Party Room do not believe in human caused global warming at all. I disagree with that assessment, but many people in the community will be excused for thinking the leadership ballot proved him right.

Remember Nick Minchin's defense of the Howard Government's ETS was that the Government was panicked by the polls and therefore didn't really mean it.

Tony himself has, in just four or five months, publicly advocated the blocking of the ETS, the passing of the ETS, the amending of the ETS and, if the amendments were satisfactory, passing it, and now the blocking of it.

His only redeeming virtue in this remarkable lack of conviction is that every time he announced a new position to me he would preface it with "Mate, mate, I know I am a bit of a weather vane on this, but....."

Third, there is a major issue of integrity at stake here and Liberals should reflect very deeply on it. We have an Opposition whose current leadership dismisses the Howard Government's ETS policy as being just a political ploy. We have an Opposition Leader who has in the space of a few months held every possible position on the issue, each one contradicting the position he expressed earlier. And finally we have an Opposition which negotiated amendments to the Rudd Government's ETS, then reached agreement on those amendments and then, a week later, reneged on the agreement.

Many Liberals are rightly dismayed that on this vital issue of climate change we are not simply without a policy, without any prospect of having a credible policy but we are now without integrity. We have given our opponents the irrefutable, undeniable evidence that we cannot be trusted.

Not that anyone would doubt it, but I will be voting for the ETS legislation when it returns in February and if my colleagues have any sense they will do so as well.

 

 




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Comments

Anonymous
# Anonymous
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:24 AM
http://topsy.com/tb/tinyurl.com/ylk9f7p
Anonymous
# Anonymous
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:30 AM
Social comments and analytics for this post
Stu
# Stu
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:30 AM
Thanks Malcolm. Keep making noise! Maybe you can convince some more of your colleagues in the senate to get this thing over the line.
Aron
# Aron
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:35 AM
This is so true. Someone's got to bash some heads together around here. Keep up the good work!
Richard
# Richard
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:37 AM
Malcolm,

There is no doubt that we need to do something, but I and many other Liberal voters are not sure Rudd's ETS is the best way of doing it. It is insulting to suggest, as the PM has done, that if you oppose the ETS you are a climate change sceptic. This illogical view implicates Bob Brown and the Greens are climate change sceptics because they voted against the ETS. The Liberals must come up with a policy, but your "straight talk" does the non-Labor cause no good and retards our ability to have a rational internal debate about an alternative.
Clio
# Clio
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:43 AM
Great posting. Clear and concise. The best role you could play in this Malcolm would be as an independent in the Senate. I'm afraid the Liberal party is too divided on this. Abbot's bounce in the polls shows that there are still many in our society who believe we can just ignore the train light at the other end of the tunnel!
AB
# AB
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:43 AM
Good on you. Hopefully more of your colleagues look into themselves for a bit of conviction on this.
Ric
# Ric
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:45 AM
Richard - I think part of Malcolm's point is that the party's "ability to have a rational internal debate about an alternative" is already proven to be deficient.
James Glover
# James Glover
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:46 AM
It is true that it is the Opposition's role is to oppose or question the government at every turn but occasionally in large matters such as war the govt and opposition come to an agreement on a policy acceptable to both - at least in the spirit of compromise. Climate Change is just such an issue. Yes there are lots of people out there who think its all "left wing bullshit" (like my 77yo father) but they will, unfortunately, hold that view regardless of the evidence. For Tony Abbott to exploit this issue for short term political gain is egregious stupidity and damages us all in the long run and if you care about it, the Liberal Party as well.

Keep up the fight Mr Turnbull. Your country needs you!
Mike
# Mike
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:46 AM
Is everything always so black & white in your world? Are your comments constructive? Really? Or are you throwing nothing more than an articulate tantrum? Personal attacks on the opposition with different views are the type of school yard tactics found at my son's primary school. If you want to gain my respect - Play the ball not the man!
simon bedak
# simon bedak
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:46 AM
Egotistical has been.
Anonymous
# Anonymous
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:47 AM
http://ozpolitik.wordpress.com/2009/12/07/newspoll-5/
glenn
# glenn
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:48 AM
love it
bring on the next lib leader
Tony
# Tony
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:48 AM
You are the only one in your party speaking sense Malcolm.

Keep fighting the good fight.

Being an effective opposition doesn't mean just being disagreeable. Sometimes bipartisan consensus is called for.

Abbott is indeed full of bulls$it, and many of us long term liberal voters appreciate you calling him out on it.
Danielle Ecuyer
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:49 AM
Excellent comments. The truth about what is happening in the Liberal Party needs to be told. The financial reality of how to reduce emissions needs to be told.
Go Malcolm
Alan
# Alan
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:52 AM
Malcolm - sour grapes comes to mind. Give me a break. You banter has as much BS in it as anyone who wants to take bat and ball and not play the game. Grow up - the people of Australia have spoken (seen today's opinion poll ... the BEST opposition leader support BEFORE your time).

Your leadership is over. It is good to have Tony leading the party - we have a point of difference and not more Rudd shadows.

Do us all a favour - get out of the parliament and stop earning my tax payer dollars.
antonio
# antonio
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:53 AM
Maybe Malcolm if you did not pander to the labor party and had evoked a national debate on the ets and bringing in a new tax then you wouldn't be on the backbench would you?

Abbot may be a lot of things but at least he is a real alternative to rudd rather than a cliche.
Greg
# Greg
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:55 AM
When the LNP splits into the Conservatives and the Liberals, the Liberals will have my membership and vote.
Alan
# Alan
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:55 AM
Well said Antonio.

Malcolm - you were a leader of a great party. You were also part of bringing it to its knees.

Malcolm - in the words of someone far more popular than myself: "it's time to go - you are the weakest link - goodbye!"
Barry
Monday, December 07, 2009 9:56 AM
Agree Malcolm entirely, unfortunately for Australia the long,diffilcult and complicated work that Penny Wong did on this important national issue has been sidelined. Abbott should be seen for what he is a political thug who will duck and weave on the issue to try and score political points. This should be a matter of National/International Importance and as such deserves Bi-partisan support which you gave. And Richard no the ETS in its current form was a framrwork tp get the ETS rolling and give time to massive polluters to change the form of energy they used in electricity production. AS Penny Wong said it was not a 'Ferrari' but could be adjuested over time as countires around the world tweeked up their carbon targets. Thanks for this post Malcolm.
Richard
# Richard
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:02 AM
Ric - I don't think that the ALP and their union colleagues are entirely supportive of an ETS. Friends of mine who are Labor Party members say there are divergent views at a branch level, but that debate has been shut down by the powers that be. At least the Libs are discussing options.

Barry - If $123 billion for polluters is your idea of an important first step on carbon emissions, we will have to agree to disagree.
anon61
# anon61
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:03 AM
Malcolm,

Do you realise that you are a LIBERAL Member of Parliament? You need to start learning the meaning of being a member of the Liberal Party. Having your own opinion is one thing. But openly going after members of your own party is unforgivable...
Dave Gaukroger
# Dave Gaukroger
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:03 AM
Thanks for letting your integrity guide you on this issue Malcolm. Climate Change needs to be addressed and we need more than Tony Abbott's empty rhetoric.

What a shame that the Howard government hadn't addressed this issue years ago when the cost of action would have been so much less.
Ray
# Ray
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:04 AM
You are a bad LOSER Mr Turnbull go back to Private Enterprise where you were a WINNER
Tim
# Tim
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:05 AM
You should quit the party before you embark on a public campaign to destroy it.
Tom Pynnonen
# Tom Pynnonen
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:05 AM
Malcolm speaks the truth. You cannot trust Abbott or his cronies. Talk about Kenneally being a puppet; whose puppet is Abbott?
Mike
# Mike
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:07 AM
tell me Malcolm...with yours and Rudd's great big tax bringing costing us more...who wins...where does the extra money you take from us go? If it really is a big tax...are we going to see a tax cut somewhere else? Lower the GST? Cut income tax rates?
John Waller
# John Waller
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:09 AM
Malcolm,

It's time to shut up and let Tony get on with leading the Liberal Party and winning the next election.

You've had your turn. Your party has said thanks but no thanks.
Lou minter
# Lou minter
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:09 AM
Oh for heavens sake. Malcolm, you were upset when your model for a Republic was dismissed and you are upset now because you are dismissed once again. Malcolm, unclench yours fists, stop stamping your feet and stop behaving like a spoiled brat. Be quiet and let your party get it's act together.
Graeme
# Graeme
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:09 AM
Malcolm

This is in the first instance not about the reality of climate change, it is about the appropriateness of Rudds ETS as the appropriate solution.

You and Rudd are arrogantly out of touch with public opinion - we the people need to understand the detail and implications of Rudds ETS - you dont vote for what you dont understand!

Sending the ETS to a senate committee for review was the simple solution for the opposition, pushing the legislation out past Copenhagen and giving everyone including the public more time to effectively understand and consider it.

I am a Wentworth resident who has supported you in the past but your performance on this issue and this extraordinary and pathetic white anting effort by you has put that to an immediate end.

You are out of touch and out of line.
Peter
# Peter
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:12 AM
As usual, you're hell bent on getting your own way like a typical spoilt brat, and couldn't care less about anyone else. Clearly you've now made your bed as far as your political future is concerned, with your environmental concerns I suspect running as deep as reading the writing on the wall as far as retaining your own "green" seat, you're determined on bringing the rest of the Liberal Party down with you.

I'm all for industry and us consumers cleaning up our act, but let's face it, the scientific "proof" on our level of impact on climate change - hot or cold - is not clear cut. What I can't believe is that somone of your apparent intellect is willing to adopt the line that a wopping big tax is going to fix the problem.

Never mind Peter Costello - YOU look like becoming the greatest Prime Minister we never had, simply because you can't keep your ego in check. You had such potential - I can't believe you've descended to this.
Greg
# Greg
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:12 AM
Good on you Malcolm. Glad to see the Libs still have some sanity tucked away on the back benches.
Allyson
# Allyson
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:13 AM
Sounds like a case of sour grapes. Malcolm, remember one thing: your not leader anymore, so but out!!
Paul
# Paul
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:14 AM
Good on you Malcolm! Unfortunately you joined the wrong party.
Garbo
# Garbo
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:16 AM
We need action on climate change. Liberal party has no future unless they become serious about this issue.
Moreover, this issue is more important than the party. So hopefully, other liberal MP's and senators will continue to put pressure on the skeptics to act in the interest of the nation rather than simply serve their own beliefs.
will
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:16 AM
Mr Turnbull,

I'll preface this by saying I strongly disagree with most of your policy, economics and taxation in particular. That said I believe many of the above comments were entirely correct vis a vie the Liberal Party's needing a cohesive approach to being in opposition.
It is quite obvious that Mr Abbott is there because John the Baptist cannot let go. You know better then most what Howard wanted and he hadn't yet accomplished all of it. So, when Abbott is defeated at the next election and Hockey makes his play for the leadership make sure you're still there to push the climate change agenda in the Party Room, someone in that party has to pull the collective head out of the sand so the new generations of Australians will consider the Liberal Party a serious opposition.
As I said, I do not agree with most of your or indeed the Liberal Party as a wholes policy, but I am also very concerned at the idea of a one party Australia. Make climate change a point the incumbent government will have to make politically competitive policy decisions and please don't be afraid to spend on it,
regards,
W. Maguire
Patricia
# Patricia
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:18 AM
Keep it up Malcolm. The liberal party needs a real leader who has vision for this country. I know like everyone that the ETS was not perfect but we all need to start this job somewhere. No one is saying it will stay in this format for the next 50 to 100 years but its a start on the road. The loss of 10 years means our country is that far behind change and the new economies of this world. We will end up a third rate country unless we embrace the change. Just like the beginning of industrialization those that moved with it were the power houses of the future. So we must go the next stage so we can have a future economy that is prosperous and adaptable.
Chris
# Chris
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:19 AM
Your a farce now Malcolm, you have no alternate vision for Australia you had the chance to lead Australia to be something great.

An ETS for a country that would reduce global emissions by less than 1% is stupid and horrendously inefficient - To be honest I'm not sure why you support Kevin Rudd's money-go-round.

If you were serious about tackling our emissions footprint the targets would be much higher, the current targets are too low to have any meaningful impact anyway so what is the point in spending 126 Billion to achieve nothing, I'd much rather we'd have done double the effort and actually achieved something (however minor it would be).
Doug Matthews
# Doug Matthews
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:19 AM
M.T Stop your dummy spitting serve the party you joined to help the nation or resign.
Verity
# Verity
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:20 AM
At last, someone who shows integrity and isn't afraid to speak out against the current "bullshit" of the party! Keep it up, Malcolm. Turn the disappointments of the past few weeks into positive outcomes. People are turning away in droves from negative, fear based commentary and strategies used by people to promote and defend "minority" viewpoints. Just watch the criticism of this post as evidence!
Realist
# Realist
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:20 AM
You should go join Labor instead of having a dummy spit. The only constant in the world is change, and it is extraordinarily arrogant to think that humans can do anything to stop it.

The ETS is flawed and a load of crap, hence why everyone except for Labor voted against it.

Abbott has the balls to raise nuclear energy as an answer and you didn't. Fact is, nuclear energy and the soon coming mass-produced electric cars are going to fix any problems with air pollution, which is much more important than "carbon emissions". It's the free market solution, if only the government allows enterprise to count nuclear as an option.
CB
# CB
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:20 AM
I am an avid Labor voter, but have also been torn to be a supporter of you Malcolm (as a wentworth resident) and was very sad to see you out. Your rationality and sensitivity in leadership was great to see. Best of luck with future ventures. Keep fighting the good fight- and the man with the ball now will drop it in due course, he is a ticking time bomb of hysterical nay-saying political mishaps with no manners and a tempestuous disposition. The game is almost not worth playing when he is team captain.
Mick Bell
# Mick Bell
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:20 AM
I agree Mr Turnbull . However you are showing signs Mark Latham like qualities at present. You need to reign in that famous temper of yours.
Mick Bell, QLD
Sue
# Sue
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:21 AM
I've been a conservative voter all my voting years. I feel as though my opinions don't matter to anyone in the Liberal party at the moment. I certainly don't feel like voting for any of the current Liberal members. If I thought an ETS would serve any real purpose (apart from taxing me to the hilt) then I would like to see it discussed openly not rushed into law because KRudd wants to be the first to jump on the bandwagon. I thought the opposition was supposed to oppose.
denise
# denise
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:22 AM
just love your blogg and i am labor it must be great to have wide appeal not like Mr. Abbott.
Australian news paper have a strange way on interpreting polls have
have you seen the new poll today.

: 56-44 Nielson
O and i think its wonderful your Lucy goes everywhere with you
re something i read on this site.
that is how married life should be, we share everything 41 years today.
Pat Connellan
# Pat Connellan
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:22 AM
Well said, Mr Turnbull. It is time to drag the Liberal Party kicking and screaming back to the middle of Australian politics and away from the outer fringes where it has now camped.

Why the Liberals are so obsessed with their "base" ( a declining and motley collection of rural socialists, talkback radio nutters, religious fanatics and climate change denialists) is beyond me.

If you want to broaden the party's support beyond this reactionary rump, you need to modernise it. And much as the Murdoch media this morning is trumpeting the weekend by-elections as a triumph for Abbott, the fact is the Liberal's primary support has gone backwards.

You should corral the forces within caucus for another tilt at the leadership as soon as feasible. Failing that, start a new progressive liberal democratic party and watch a lot of former Labor voters switch sides.
Paul
# Paul
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:23 AM
BTW Malcolm, didn't Abbott say that if Hockey put his hat in the ring that he would stand aside?

Great way to begin his leadership - with a lie. What integrity.
Dave
# Dave
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:23 AM
I tips my hat to you Malcolm , WELL SAID .
The climate sceptics have their heads in the sand and will have their arses burnt by GB warming . Shame these loud voices have swayed the weak swingers in the blue party to this dark side of politics (and are defending their actions by saying "they give the planet benifit of doubt but not K.Rudd" )
You had to put up with Turkey , sorry typo , Tucky why not give them some home truths from the B.Bench .
The blue team have always walked the honourable side, this departure from that ethic by this small group of loud sceptics will in time catch - up with them.
Hang in there Malcolm .
CB
# CB
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:24 AM
I agree with Paul. Paul above, and PK before.... You would have been a ripper Labor leader.
matilda
# matilda
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:25 AM
Malcolm - where is the "I" in team? You never were a teamplayer. Meglo is the shortform.
Anonymous
# Anonymous
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:26 AM
http://topsy.com/tb/bit.ly/70IK2l
Vic
# Vic
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:27 AM
Malcolm: Your biggest battle is ahead of you. You need to win the Liberal party for action on climate change. You will do it. It will just take a bit of time before the idiocy which has gripped your party sinks intto the rising sea.
VCB
Claire
# Claire
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:28 AM
ETS is a strategic approach. Which ever way you look at this, it is going to cost us. Delay tactics will cost us more.

The Labor party, one which I have not supported in the past...until Rudd came in, now has my full support - a government that has taken significant action in a number of areas, and with a strategic/long term focus, unlike previous governments. Rudd and his team work hard. They lead focussing on issues, not egos. Malcolm, you are a smart man and also have my full support. It's not about Liberal or Labor....its about the leader and the issues being addressed. Abbot you are a disgrace, with no policies and everyone knows it - you are not a leader, and previous blogs not supporting Malcolm are evidence of your gang weakly supporting a baseless man.

Malcolm, work with Rudd and put your talents together. We are an educated society and we are listening and watching and value your commitment as a leader.
Oziebill
# Oziebill
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:28 AM
Malcolm

I think its time for you and like minded "liberals" to split from what has become a conservative party and an image of the U.S. Republican Party. Then you can judge proposed legislation on its merits, not just the knee jerk reaction of opposing everything.

There is ample precedent for this and this is probably your final chance to leave an indelible imprint on the nation's history.

Yes, its a big step but I'm certain you could muster enough of your colleagues to ensure the passage of the ETS in February.

adrian
# adrian
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:29 AM
You may claim that there is a scientific consensus supporting AGW, but there is no economic consensus that a carbon tax is the most effective way to mitigate the issue. In fact the Copenhagen Consensus made up of preeminent economists including noble laureates concluded that ETS style schemes are amongst the least effective way to deal with AGW. The costs they involve far out way the benefits. It would take a couple of centuries before one would be able to mitigate the 3.5c change in temperature predicated by the IPCC.

Meanwhile you have to justify spending $50 trillion across the world to try and stop a couple of degrees change in temperature, while that same money could be used to solve world hunger and malnutrition and eradicate a range of preventable diseases in the third world, thereby saving millions - with change left over to adapt food technology and general infrastructure to a possible increase in temp. - if it ever happens like the IPCC says it will.

You have once again demonstrated that you don't understand the issue and are more intent on promoting your socialist agenda for your own personal beneift than solving problems that actually exist in the here and now, not in some future world concocted by a model forced fed dubious data from academics trying to get the science to match the politics. Aka climagate.
Ray
# Ray
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:29 AM
Keep it up, Malcolm. It is obvious that Tony Abbott is unable to unite the party (first the two senators, now Helen Coonan) and the most constructive outcome might be for the party to split into conservatives and liberals (and I wonder which would be the larger group?) Abbott's novelty value might produce a bounce in the polls for a while, but unless he can come up with some policy substance it will lead nowhere.

The ETS seemed a pretty weak scheme to me but provided it didn't prevent evolution into something more effective at least it was a start. Politics is the art of the possible.
NotYourMum
# NotYourMum
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:29 AM
Oh lordy, Mr Turnbull!

You're so hot right now!

I love it when you talk like that !
reb
# reb
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:30 AM
Well said Malcolm - keep up the good work!!

http://guttertrash.wordpress.com/2009/12/07/rudd-losing-ground-on-climate-change/

Eric B
# Eric B
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:30 AM
Malcolm, you really should consider creating another party. You obviously don't take the by-elections in Higgins and Bradfield as a vote of confidence in the new liberal leader. I think you'll only be satisified if you get it direct from the horse's mouth.
reb
# reb
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:31 AM
http://guttertrash.wordpress.com/2009/12/07/rudd-losing-ground-on-climate-change
Liberal
# Liberal
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:31 AM
I am sure Tony wouldn't mind you posting your thoughts on any forum as it will expose you for what you are.You stuffed up over the Grech affair and with your legal background,you did not even check the validity of the fake emails and you were made to look like a fool over the ETS legislation.
Its embarrassing seeing you self destruct in this way,no honour in what you are doing and perhaps you should consider doing the most honourable thing,quitting Politics or more to the point quitting the Liberal Party.
David Northern Beaches
# David Northern Beaches
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:32 AM
Malcolm, thank you for your straight comments on this important issue. I look forward to more of the Liberal Party speaking out honestly and with just conviction on this matter. You have had to suffer the ignorance of the likes of Tuckey and Joyce on this issue. Best wihes for Christmas and the New Year to you and your family.
ShowsOn
# ShowsOn
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:34 AM
Abbott's claim that the CPRS will cost $120 billion is just misleading nonsense. That is how much money will be raised in 10 years, and most of it will be used to compensate households. Also, Abbott was part of the government that introduced the GST which will raise $500 billion (half a trillion) over the next 10 years. So whenever he says the ETS is a $120 billion tax, he will have to explain why that is bad yet a $500 billion tax is fine.
denise
# denise
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:34 AM
Abbott did not get a bounce in the polls it was just the way is been
interetated as i show above no change.

Neilson poll.
56 -44
also as a woman
i would never vote for party he leads.
Fefe
# Fefe
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:35 AM
@Realist, you are right the ETS is an extraordinary gift for the big polluters. What you need to realise however is that without a carbon price you will not fix the 'market failure' of carbon pollution. In fact, even nuclear energy (of which I don't agree with) will require a carbon price to compete with coal. It is not the 'free market' solution. In fact the current arrangements are more appropriately described as 'market failure'. I find it extraordinary that the right always harps on about the primacy of economics when fundamentally they are never committed to the models they claim to be proponents of. Coal is an amazing source of energy, cheap and plentiful, unless we tax it out of existence, we will never have the clean energy transition the planet needs.
Paul
# Paul
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:36 AM
I agree with Oziebill. Start a new party.

(just please ignore the impulse to call it The Malcolm Turnbull Party, that mightn't play too well)
denise
# denise
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:36 AM
o and i forgot the low voter turn out for both by elections.
No one has commentated on that.
paul
# paul
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:38 AM
Good for you Malcolm. Keep telling the truth.
You're still more of a leader than little Tony Abbot will ever be.
denise
# denise
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:44 AM
sorry that poll was News Poll

but what amused me is the 23.60 re abbott and out P.M. and how its been interrupted to sound good.
I think all new oppositions leaders started at about that and i seem to remember Malcolm's was higher.
Greg Graham
# Greg Graham
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:44 AM
Dear Malcolm. Your disloyalty to the Liberal Party is outrageous and totally unacceptable. While the leadership vote was close, the fact is you lost, and Tony immediately did the honourable thing and asked the members to vote on what what each thought on delaying or dumping the CPRS, yes or no, and they overwhelmingly voted to delay or dump rather than pass, and they did so in a secret ballot so there was no intimidation factors to sway their vote. You are now speaking against the agreed party position and actively damaging the party and I believe you have let your personal feelings about being rejected as leader blind you to this fact. Please either tow the party line, keep your feelings to yourself or offer your services to the Labor Party and switch camps. Electorally you may have more chance of retaining your seat as a Green or Labor candidate rather than a rep for the Liberals and I suspect the Liberals would rather you went this way too as you're doing the Coalition no favours at present.
GlenK
# GlenK
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:44 AM
Hi Malcolm. Well done.

Clear and concise and the ultimate weather vane. The Liberal Party has not only badly misjudged the mood of the electorate but are using fringe science and fragments of statements from experts to justify their ludicrous position. But, perhaps most importantly, they have failed the trust test. Would you trust this mob with the economy, our defence, our health care system, our foreign relations? Under no circumstances.

Here is the fact. While Mr Abbott has gained slightly higher polling than you did last month he now holds the record for the lowest preferred PM vote for any first-time leader of an opposition. And that is with a 'hand-on-the-heart' statement that he will save every household at least $1000 per year. If you can;t get a decent bounce off that then you better watch out for when the issues are actually debated.

But please, let us take Mr Abbott at his word on the commitment to 5% emissions cuts by 2020. If the front page of the Herald is right today about Mr Hockey's $50bn analysis of the 'direct action' model Mr Abbott is pushing then maybe he can tell us which hospitals he will close, which defence strategies will be shut down, how much will old age pensions be cut, which ships will we sell that currently protect our borders?

Because the greatest tragedy of all would be if the polluters were forced to pay their fair share.
Amos Keeto
# Amos Keeto
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:45 AM
Great stuff, simply great stuff Malcolm.
Alex
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:46 AM
Malcolm, thank you for your input. I however continue to remain skeptical of your dedication to effective action on climate change as climate scientists have suggested we need a much stronger reduction to emissions than you have proposed:

"Meinshausen et al. (2009) found that if a total of 1000 Gigatons of CO2 is emitted for the period 2000-2050, the likelihood of exceeding the 2-degree warming limit is around 25%. In 2000-2009, about 350 Gigatons have already been emitted, leaving only 650 Gigatons for 2010-2050. At current emission rates this budget would be used up within 20 years." (cf. Copenhagen Diagnosis) The proposed targets in the joint ALP/Coalition CPRS would have fallen far short of this goal.

Please review the science behind emission reductions and bring that to the fore of the debate. Thank you!
Tom
# Tom
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:47 AM
Reading these comments, I'm amazed at how many flat-earthers are still around in the Liberal party.

Loony climate change deniers aside, there is still a large number of Libs who grudgingly accept anthropogenic global warming but claim that an emissions trading scheme is the wrong way to tackle it. Of all people, shouldn't economic liberals embrace the ETS? Rather than mandating the redistribution it means to let the market take care of things. Surely, that should be right up the Libs' alley, no?
Earth
# Earth
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:47 AM
If only the disendorsed you. Nothing but a egocentric backstabbing bastard, you are. Tony Abbott never tried to keep pulling you down as leader. You did that yourself.
TweedleB
# TweedleB
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:47 AM
Malcolm
The Liberal Party is a TEAM. You are dear sir not part of it. It is with you, my way or no way. Join the alp as it was your first choice was it not?
Kelvin
# Kelvin
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:48 AM
To everyone calling out Malcolm for being a rebel and speaking out of turn,

You have no ground to stand on. Where were you 2-3 weeks ago when, even 2-3 months ago, when Tuckey, Joyce, Micham et al were speaking out? You don't care about the Liberal party, you are just hypocrites who only want the Liberal party to represent the far right of politics and can't stand moderates. You're criticisms have nothing to do with the issue at hand. You were the ones that created this division so if you're not tough enough to take it then maybe you should be the one that leaves
Mitchell
# Mitchell
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:48 AM
I also agree, we need a genuine third party option. Malcolm, I think you should step up.
Huskynik
# Huskynik
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:50 AM
Hi Malcolm. You sound hot. Got email?
Pat Connellan
# Pat Connellan
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:50 AM
As much as Abbott and Minchin might wish it to be otherwise, this is beyond the now redundant left-right divisions.

Most reasonable people, while never likely to get their heads around the climate change science, realise that a balance of risks approach demands coordinated global action to cut back greenhouse gas emissions.

What Labor is proposing is very similar to what Howard took to the last election and what most other developed economies are proposing - a market-based solution to climate change.

While there are arguments over whether the Liberal negotiated amendments have made the ETS too generous to polluters, this bill is a good starting point and represents, while not a perfect solution, the best possible outcome for the time being. It is definitely better than the Abbott alternative, which is basically nothing (until he finds a way of wedging Labor).

Malcolm Turnbull successfully negotiated what he and other moderates in his party saw as a realistic accommodation with the government. But, no, the denalists and irrational forces on his right - cheered on by a mainstream Murdoch media that long ago gave up the pretence of even-handedness - white-anted him.

It is patently obvious to many of us centrist, small 'l' liberal, progressive and educated urban voters that the Liberal Party is an anachronism, just as Labor is an anchronism - a legacy of late 19th and early 20th century class battles now desparately looking for a point of difference.

The reality is the Liberal Party is a reactionary, conservative party, dominated by irrational and hysterical forces hostile to sensible, moderate global policy responses to global problems. Get rid of them Malcolm.

Now
Earth
# Earth
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:52 AM
If only this overpaid tosser knew what he was talking about. Australian farmers have largely changed their farming practices and many continue to change over to Bio-Organic farming despite the political parties trying everything to make them go GM.

If you want to look at who creates the most environmental damage, blame the city mugs with all their concrete and pollution. Turncoat wouldn't know a tree if he hit one with his car.
Greg
# Greg
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:52 AM
1. In light of all leaks into the 'climate change science', I think it's simply a bad tone to keep claiming that we are prepared to give the Earth the benefit of the doubt. Give us the benefit of the doubt.
2. The liberal party is not your party, you should not be a member of it, Malcolm. Go to Labor, as you were going to at some point, or have your own party.

If you don't stand down at the next election, the party is bound to loose the seat. At least i am no longer voting for you. I'd rather tear apart my bulletin.
Ely
# Ely
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:53 AM
Please keep it up. Well done and thank you!
Samdy
# Samdy
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:53 AM
You disapoint me normally would not comment but you are playing with my day to day life and I resent that. If you honestly believe all of what you said then you need to look at the leader of the Liberal party at the time. He didn't do his job poperly. I believe that was you. You created your own platform of straight talking for the article and yet you are very selective in your quotes . Your admitting there is more than one window of opportunity to vote for this legislation You are also well aware that climate change being a real issue then no Government can totally ignore the problem. You don't have to like someone to vote for them but you do have to respect them sorry you lost me there
Julie
# Julie
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:53 AM
Malcolm
I agree with the concept of no gain without pain. I also am concerned by the lack of integrity and the "weather vane" concept exasperates me. Turnbull and Joyce together would run a good fish'n'chip shop.

However, what I would like to do is understand more on the issues and on the alternatives. I am reading as much and as widely as I can, but nearly everything comes with an agenda.

Could you put up a series of FAQs and provide your thoughts on each of them. At least I know where you are coming from.
Anonymous
# Anonymous
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:54 AM
Social comments and analytics for this post
corbarb
# corbarb
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:54 AM
The average person has really no idear of what is going on.So much od Al Gore can not be proved and his behaviour is not helping.The new email scandel is another problem.What are we supposed to belive.
Hide The Decline
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:54 AM
Malcolm, with all due respect, STFU. You lost the leadership AND the ETS ballot in the party room. What does that tell you? Only Labor and Goldman Sachs would benifit by the introduction of an ETS. It is becoming obvious you are NOT working for the majority of conservative voters who had their say on the weekend and it seems they don't agree with you either! Get it yet?

I once thought you would make a great PM. Sad to say, but you are not going to be remembered in a good light if you keep these childish outbursts up. Not a great legacy for a public figure......
nicksr
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:55 AM
Keep fighting - although I didnt agree with your politics you fought a fair fight and addressed issues and the ETS as you saw it. Now the Libs are taking an unprincipled cop-out stance full knowing the masses simply go for legislation that doesnt hurt the wallet - little thinking that ETS is about our global long term survival for all generations everywhere.

As you say the Libs have not ETS policy just hollow rhetoric. A tragic shame that people care more about their next plasma TV than our environment's future. And the Libs now to their shame shall be milking these voters for all the support they can muster with their new spin and venom.

Indeed M. a third party would be a blessing to Australia.

All the best anyhow at Xmas.
Marie
# Marie
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:55 AM
Dear Malcolm Here's a note of encouragement from a demographic usually dubbed 'rusted on Liberals'. My friends

and I ( all over 70) are dismayed at the parlous state of the Liberal Party and cannot believe the mouthings of Nick

Minchin and his foot soldiers. We are trying to assess the hidden agenda and can only come up with the 'born to

rule' syndrome driving their frantic attempts to raise a fear of climate change and the ETS solution among those

most important people, the swinging voters.

I am now a financial member of the Greens, my protest against the Opposition's negative view of climate change

and the failure of the incumbents to sort out the disastrous mess called our Public Hospital System.

You appear as a man of logic and clear thinking and I commend your courage in facing up to your enemies.

You already have the support of 41 members and have the capacity to encourage them to develop a bi-

partisan solution to help save our troubled planet. I encourage you to 'maintain your rage". (Thanks 1975)

You may be amused to hear that we, in our presumed dotage, have devised a new game. Whenever we hear on TV the words,

"great big new tax" we reach for the remote and change channels. We resent Abbott's transparent attempt to implant

his mantra into the long term memory of every viewer.
Ing
# Ing
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:56 AM
Love it Mal!
I am not a Liberal voter, and must admit that I voted against you in the seat of Wentworth last election - but your determination on this issue has won me over. Thank you for being a voice for all of us trying to do our bit, let's hope it's not in vain.
Andrew Rock
# Andrew Rock
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:56 AM
Straight talk indeed.

Tony Abbott is following the Lying Rodent's strategy: say anything, do anything for power. As well, using the populist strategy: telling morons it's OK to be a moron. Why shouldn't he? It works.
chris
# chris
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:56 AM
your being so UN AUSTRALIAN. don't do any more damage then you have already done.If you don't like the liberal party GET OUT. But don't be seen as KRUDDs lap dog. you were a better person than that.
Barry
# Barry
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:57 AM
Well said Malcolm. Thank you for your integrity on this issue.
frank
# frank
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:57 AM
We, the voters do not want any more closed rooms party discussions, what we want and most australians need is an open debate about the subject as I am sure most ordinary voters have no idea of the implications in adopting a policy in this matter (one way or the other).
I agree whith the new liberal leader in respect to inform the people of Australia in simple terms what is it that we are risking for the future of our kids and if nothing, then say it in an open debate.
Also, we would like to remind Malcolm and Rudd that they owed alliance to Australia first and then to the world and not the other way around.
I, personally work in areas of housing commission and ordinary australians who live the day to day on a less than a minimum wage and they do not understand anything about ETS, Global warming (now more confusing with the knowledge of the emails from the scientist community in England, covering up the findings or enhancing maliciously the data found), carbon print, etc. They worry about the food they put on the table on a daily basis.
Darren
# Darren
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:57 AM
Top stuff Malcolm - you're a man of integrity.

You're within your right as a member of the party to voice your opinion. In the words of Don Chipp 'keep the bastards honest'.
Tracey
# Tracey
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:59 AM
good on ya Malcolm....everyone is talking about how Abbott is a 'conviction' politician but he is anything but that...he changes his mind like the wind.
For my money, you are the conviction politician and have stood firm in your belief on climate change when Abbott is on record as calling it 'crap'.
Keep up the good work and keep the pressure on.
Cheers and Merry Xmas!
Matta
# Matta
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:00 AM
Mr Turnbull,

You should stop pretending the ETS will do anything to curb climate change. It is a disguise for the Labor party and your own inability to do something substantial. An ETS is just a tax, which means emissions wont be cut, they will just cost more. And with YOUR amendments, the biggest polluters can keep polluting anyway.

I am personally offended by yours and Rudd's argument of "If you're against THIS ETS you are a climate sceptic", because that is rubbish. Stop hijacking the debate by framing it as such.

I believe climate change is happening and LOTS needs to be done, but I think this ETS is a sham, as is the whole notion of 'Emissions Trading'.

Why don't you stop being so closed minded and actually listen to what Abbott has to say on the policy and then criticise. You are criticising something that does not yet exist.


I voted Labor at the last election, but if Abbott opposes the ETS I will vote Liberal.
Petar
# Petar
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:01 AM
Many Australians feel they have been disenfranchised by BOTH of the major political parties... we need a 'third way'. Present one please, the public need representation...
Hamish
# Hamish
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:01 AM
Malcolm, assuming you actually read this and I dearly hope you do... You are not the leader, you lost the vote, Abbott blows you out of the water in the polls and now you're displaying the worst case of SOUR GRAPES ever seen in Australian Politics by attempting to undermine the party you once led. Take your spite somewhere else. If you are so confident that your electorate agrees with you, stand down as the member for Wentworth and run again as an independent. Put up OR SHUT UP!
Matt
# Matt
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:02 AM
Could not have said it better!! >>

# Hide The Decline
Monday, December 07, 2009 10:54 AM
Malcolm, with all due respect, STFU. You lost the leadership AND the ETS ballot in the party room. What does that tell you? Only Labor and Goldman Sachs would benifit by the introduction of an ETS. It is becoming obvious you are NOT working for the majority of conservative voters who had their say on the weekend and it seems they don't agree with you either! Get it yet?
Clive
# Clive
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:03 AM
Malcolm,
You are acting like a 2 year old who hasn't got his way. Your behaviour is a disgrace and I am more glad now that you lost the opposition leadership than I was when you first lost it.
Pull your head in and give the new leader Tony Abbot a chance to give the Liberals a chance at the next election.
Understand, that the Liberals is more than just about you!
You should be ashamed of yourself!!!!!!
Tusker's Rescue
# Tusker's Rescue
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:03 AM

So the thing is this ... let's have a look at the Venn Diagram shall we?!!! Hmmm.... how come that the very same people who are calling the few 1000 or so Tamils (and of course a few dodgy Sinhalese crims and economic refugees) that are fleeing Sri Lanka ..."scum" are the same drongos who don't believe in climate change?

Malcolm, you should have started saying no to this mob when they jumped on the right-wing fascist band-wagon and got all xenophobic about 1000 Tamils. You didn't and that was wrong and you know it.

I have lived in Wenthworth for two decades, who I vote for is not really the issue. I supported you on the Republican issue .. and there again you got done like a dog's dinner by John Howard. I was confident that there were enough Libs who would stand up and push aside 12 years of stupidity under Howard regarding climate change but oh no, you got done like a dogs dinner again!

We did manage to finally say sorry to indigenous Australians, (albeit while Wilson Tuckey sneered from the balcony), you said sorry to the lost generation and for these two things we can be proud that Australia is moving away from ignoring it's past and towards correcting it's mistakes.

So now what? The Liberals who are not living in some dark hole, waving the Union Jack, thumping a big bible and who have got a brain, MUST re-invent themselves.

I think Malcolm, you should give Tony absolutely heaps but for God's sake start listening to ALL Australians not just the power-brokers and special interest groups in the Lib-National coalition. How does Tony Abbott think he's going to get the vote of Muslims, of Gay people, of Greenies, of women (don't care what the polls say). Do you want to be tarnished with the same brush? No - well you're going to have to prove that YOU are an alternative to Tony Abbott and the right brigade - can someone write the song :-) !!!

If you cannot remain with the Liberals because they are about to self-destruct ... go it alone. Become an independent. Stand for true libertarian views. There are many, many dissatisfied Libs out there. There are a few unhappy Labour voters ... more so with State politics - either way we need a third force.

Tony Abbott should join the Nationals and realise that it's a sin to tell lies.

I'd like to see you take him on - but I really think it's time you listen as well.

Jeffrey Tapping
# Jeffrey Tapping
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:05 AM
Thanks Malcolm for TRUTHFUL straight talking, instead of that designed solely for personal gain. I recently submitted a letter to New Scientist on the topic of politician's attitude to climate change evidence, and said in part, "Deniers such as the senior Australian politician who says that climate change is an international left-wing conspiracy need to be challenged for the evidence for their statements. They want iron-clad evidence from us, but accept blind assertions from themselves."
Michael
# Michael
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:06 AM
Keep it coming Malcolm. You're alright with me.
Pugwash
# Pugwash
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:06 AM
Thankyou Malcom for putting good science and long term policy ahead of short term political thinking.

If the Coalition has any sense, they'll let the wingnuts become the minority they actually are and put you back as leader.
gerry eaton
# gerry eaton
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:08 AM
Poor old crash or crash through Mal finally crashed out.

Your sound like a jilted lover Mal why don't you piss off and leave politics to politicians.

If you look at the opinion polls most Australians think your nothing but a bully boy with bad manners.
John
# John
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:10 AM
Malcolm

For someone with such high intelligence you also appear to be below average in some areas. You are looking like a spoiler now and your leadership has in the past made Kevin the Rudd look good. People have the right to ask if you are in the wrong party. Some didnt trust that you were a true liberal going back to the republic debate, and now with you throwing mud at the party at a time when they least need it, some may even suggest your desire is to destroy the party.

Please, if you care about the liberal party just let Tony have have some room to breathe as he has a great deal of rebuilding to do. Tony will make a fine leader and needs to be given a fair go . You can have your opinion but right now is hardly the time to be expressing it publicly
Jason
# Jason
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:10 AM

Lol at the people commenting on MT's lack of loyalty. Where was the loyalty shown by various members of his own party throughout his term as opp leader?

Comment above about a TEAM made me laugh the hardest.
John
# John
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:11 AM
Good post Mal.
Thought about defecting to the ALP? There's a lot of republicans and people who believe in climate change over there. It happens... look at Japan... their current PM was a senior member of the conservative party. Changed tack, now he's PM...

Why bother with Abbott and Minchin?
The far left and the far right are both tripe, but the ALP have this thing called the Greens, which takes away people from the far-left, so you don't have to pretend they are your best friends.
Nick L
# Nick L
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:11 AM
Great comments Malcolm. Climate change is a reality. I work with scientists around the world and there is not one respectable scientific organisation I know which is not doing work on climate change. Governments around the world are spending money now - vast sums. The reality is that Governments, and REAL scientists have seen the problem for years and they are doing things about it NOW. But they need to do more.

What we hear as a public is ALL of the of political bullshit which is aimed simply at parties getting re-elected.

Why don't we all accept that people who are far more knowledable than the vast majority of us have recognised the problem for what it is - bloody huge and only just manageable. The media and political banter is game which just gets in the way of the work that needs to be done.

What is a terrible shame is the amount of time we are all wasting and especially the disctractions we are putting in front of people who can make a difference.

Malcolm a traitor to his party?? Well who cares because he not a traitor to humanity.
Dan
# Dan
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:11 AM
Hi Malcolm,

Keep up the good fight. All the comments here show that the community is far from united on this one. I believe that if the policy wasn't going to be so effective in reducing pollution, we wouldn't be hearing all the noise. As Eric Campbell-Geddes said "squeeze the...lemon until the pips squeak"

Good luck and hang in there.
Peta
# Peta
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:12 AM
Malcolm, I appreciate your concerns on the environment. I appreciate your passionate support in what you believe. I do not appreicate the arrogance you show however in any debate on the topic. You do not have a mandate to force your opinion on the whole country and it may come as a shock but you are not always right. I would have thought your experience with the Republic debate would have taught you a lesson - I think that vote was lost because of your arrogance in running the debate. I also do not appreciate you running down the Liberal party. Perhaps you should start your own party - call it Malcolm First.
Rohan
# Rohan
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:12 AM
Malcolm - you have been crucified by half your own party for doing the right thing.

The fact that you were ousted only demonstrates the myopia of Abbot and his supporters, and shows to me that they are more interested in the politics of the ETS than they are in keeping Australia at the front of the pack of developed economies. Europe has a fully functioning ETS, america is emerging from a dark time in its political history and will no doubt sign up soon. Abbot's actions have bumped us to the back of the pack.

An ETS is not a matter of "IF", but "WHEN".

ETS damaging to the economy? No - there will be a short period of readjustment and then it will be business as usual, no more than the period of adjustment we had for the GST, the period of adjustment we had when lead based fuels / certain refrigerants were banned.
Climate change real? It seems that way - overwhealming scientific consensus on the topic, but vocal opposition from those who have a financial / emotional interest in high pollution levels.
ETS a certainty? I'd say yes - any block now is just delaying the inevitable.
Will we all benefit from ETS? Absolutely - less pollution therefore environmental benefits for all of us (if you've ever been to china you know how bad it can be). Related industries (alternative energy, clean production, carbon credits) will flourish, and technology will be eventually passed on to the consumer (imagine an australia where every home could afford solar technology).

Malcolm - although the ETS was probably not the strongest in the world, you can stand tall for having the foresight to realise that it will happen whether deniers want it to or not.
James Nguyen
# James Nguyen
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:13 AM
Malcolm, I am totally supportive of your stance on climate change policy and the sooner you return to the Liberal leadership, the better. Tony Abbott may have exited the Liberal party 'base' but Sarah Palin had the similar effect with Republican. Being combative just for the sake of it is not what moderate voters (the majority of the electorate) want. Australia needs more principle politicians like yourself.
Toby Fiander
# Toby Fiander
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:14 AM
Those who oppose the carbon trading scheme need to look at what other nations have done, particularly in Europe. Mostly it is a trading scheme - I am sure it is possible to learn from their mistakes, and there have been some. Australia has schemes for trading in rights (eg. rural water). The schemes tend not to act as a tax, but they do shift the value of actions of property.

There is an argument for a carbon tax, as well as a trading scheme. Those with some experience think there ought to be a tax as well as a trading scheme. The proceeds of this can be like the proceeds of the petrol tax, which supplements general revenue or they can be like the proceeds of the Medicare Levy, which does not cover the cost of that scheme.

There are also arguments for agricultural sequestration and low carbon technologies generally.

None of these things is going to fix the problem alone, and nothing will work unless you either legislate certain actions or make the actions follow from establishment of a market to give carbon a price.

Those who think that this is someone else's problem need to look carefully at the ethical implications of their present lifestyle. In the longer term, they will be causing the death of other people in weather related disasters and the extinction of plant and animal species. Those who say change to a low carbon economy cannot be afforded now, or that other trading nations will be advantaged compared to Australia should realise they are using the same arguments that opposed the abolition of slavery. Slavery did not see the end of civilisation, and neither will transition to a low carbon economy, whether we elect to do it now, or it is forced on us later with considerably higher costs.

Malcolm's points, made in his characteristic way, whether you like that or not, are simply the truth. He has shown real leadership when others wanted to prevaricate.

Perhaps Malcolm failed to bring the slow learners with him, because, arguably, that is the job of a leader, too. But he has made his stand for the well-being of humanity and used his influence for good.

Mate, mate... nice work, mate.
Boris
# Boris
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:14 AM
Malcolm go your own way. You could be the 3rd alternative in politics. Take over the democrats, they are just a shell desperately needing leadership and finances. You will probably get 6-10 MP's coming with you. You may even get some labour people. We need a 3rd voice that occupies the middle ground
Ben
# Ben
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:15 AM
Tony Abbot 2004 – "Climate change is a load of crap"....

Tony Abbot 2012 – "Greenland is a load of crap"....
Ronny Susanto
# Ronny Susanto
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:15 AM
Well, if you asked me whether i support Mr. Turnbull or not few weeks or months ago? the answer will be No. But, I must agree on this issue with him. Not that I agree with him in many policies and issues but to see him critizing Mr Abbott is a brave thing to do. Mr Abbott policy (no that he has any...yet...if he ever) is an absolute non-sense.

Mr Turnbull I applaud you and your decision to cross the floor when this issue, re-introduced to the parliament, next year. I do hope you keep and stand up for what you believe in. Well don!
ozgirl58
# ozgirl58
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:15 AM
Malcolm I am a Labour voter, however I admire you for your integrity. Abbott is a fuc*wit and does not care about anythingbut himself. The bloke is an idiot. Whines about everything even to the point on TV yesterday complaining about the PM and Premier of NSW being at church and TV crews outside. Start your own party.
David
# David
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:15 AM
Go join the Labor party then. You have joined the "Global Warming" religion - the proof is far from conclusive that any climate change is the result of human activity. You are a sore loser that is used to getting your own way.
Nathan
# Nathan
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:15 AM
Malcolm, You want some home truths? Can you really handle the home truths?

1. Abbott may have said what he thought in the shaddow cabnet meetings, but he didn't bring it public untill the leader (yourself) blatently ignored the partyroom

2. Global warming myth is coming appart at the seams, have you investigated climategate? Maybe you need to come clean and tell us all what you have to gain from it all.

3. The majroity of Australians either don't understant the ETS and its implications also the majority of Australians don't believe in rushing the legislation through prior to copenhagen and prior to the big polluters doing their bit.

4. Your and your labor mates target of 5% of Australias emmissions is actually 0.007% of global emmissions. In other words nothing that will make any difference to global climate, and $120 Billion new tax to do nothing except make you and your banker mates rich.

5. You are doing nothing but distroying the party. At least Costello stayed quiet on the backbench so you could have your chance which you failed due to your ego and your labor party stance. You have no one else to blame but yourself. Go and starty your new party. You think you will take votes off the Liberals with your socialist policies? i doubt it , the only people you will steal is the Labor votors and then it won't be many.

You are a disgrace to the Liberal party and a disgrace to conservitive politics.

Can you handle these home truth's Malcolm?

Or are you trying to overtake Mark Latham as the most unstable politician in Australian Politics. The best thing the Liberal Party can do is preselect somone else for your seat of Wentworth unless you get back in line and be a team player.
GB Dorrington
# GB Dorrington
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:16 AM
One of the few comments by Turnbull that I am inclined to strongly agree with. The Libs are now commanded by an Abbott and Bishop, and only God will save them from the crap they are now peddling. As for their chances at an election, that is entirely laughable; I predict Abbott will be out in 6-8 months.
Michael
# Michael
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:17 AM
Thank you Malcolm for speaking with conviction on this topic. To all those out there who criticise based on 'not following the party line' how about assessing the importance of this issue.

We need politicians who can speak with honesty and integrity and it is refreshing to hear someone stand by his principles and not reinvent them every 5 minutes because they think that is what will win votes!!!!!
Pete
# Pete
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:17 AM
I always thought you were a twonk for selling OzEmail to Worldcom. We're still paying for that selloff and collapse today. At last, you've started along that long road of redemption in my eyes. As a New (Classic? Traditional?) Liberal, I'm greatly hearted.
# Rex
# # Rex
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:17 AM
Good on you Malcolm. Straight talking as usual..

Abbot is only where he is so Minchin and his cronies can control their agenda. How on earth could Abbot deal with world leaders?, He alters his position every five minutes and has absolutely no integrity whatsoever- What a joke the party has become.
PLEASE BRING ON ANOTHER SPILL, and get back where you belong. (those in the team with talent and integrity need you)
HotWaterService
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:17 AM
@TurnbullMalcolm: Impressed by your consistent stance on climate change! It is too important to play politics (Tony are you listening? )!

Best Wishes HotWaterService
david roden
# david roden
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:17 AM
Thanks for the 'straight talking'. Let's hope some more of your colleagues will actually listen and follow suit. I was dismayed that the new Member for Bradfield started talking climate-change-double-speak as soon as Tony Abbott was elected leader.
Get_Therapy
# Get_Therapy
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:18 AM
I have no idea how you managed to avoid the 'conflict of interest' question from the media over this issue. Ex-chair of Goldman Sachs, shareholder in ...., mates all over the world who stand to make BILLIONS from an ETS.

Malcolm, just go and join the Labor party and be done with it.

You are behaving like my 5 year old.
Neil
# Neil
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:19 AM
The utter hypocrisy of four positions on climate change in four months, and the populace wait with baited breath for his new position?
Tony is a chameleon, and for someone who professes to have strong Christian principles, I find his commitment to a position solely for the purpose of political-power gamesmanship, to be rather queer.
Give it less than a week and he will be firing up the border protection issues with a fearful rhetoric.
People admire Tony because he is not afraid to express his views. Unfortunately, these same people are not at all concerned about what his views are.
But why would anyone? It changes to match the electable landscape, but not to the groans of an Earth in crisis!
LMB
# LMB
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:20 AM
Malcolm,

1. The credibility of undermining comments by the loser in a leadership contest means the value of your comments say more about you than about the position you espouse.

2. The Australian federal political scene has a precedent for the course you are embarking on. You are flirting with becoming - and risk being viewed as - Lathamesq.

3. Whilst your conviction is to be admired, politics is about achieving outcomes and this is something Tony - as a dyed in the wool political animal - has a grasp of. You demonstrably do not. My admiration for your conviction would be worth more than a passing reflection if you allowed your ego to get out of the way of achieving the outcome you so passionately feel is worth advancing.

4. You have done your ETS cause a disservice by establishing it as an act of faith in Malcolm, rather than in the ETS and climate change action itself.

5. All the above leads me to believe that you have done more to harm climate change action in Australia by associating yourself with it, than by not being involved at all. Your participation in the debate has the direct consequence of the Opposition position (or - for now - lack of one) we have now.

6. The body politic understand that your personality deficiencies are the real issue here. You respect strength and toughness. Demonstrate some by reconciling yourself to whatever demons so obviously torpedo your prodigious talent. Doing so will deliver to the Australian community the fullness of the promise you hold to us.
Peter
# Peter
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:21 AM
Malcolm, did you used to throw temper tantrums in the aisles at the supermarket?
marcus
# marcus
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:21 AM
Malcolm is this sour grapes, are you going to destroy the Liberal Party because you were dumped...The problem is all Liberals politicians have a born to rule mentality. Who is lurking in the background...hmmm
Ron
# Ron
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:22 AM
Are you Australia's Al Gore? Made more of an impact outside politics than he did when he was in the political system...You have a lot to offer Australia and we shouldn't lose you from public life...
Rowan
# Rowan
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:24 AM
Malcolm, what are you doing? Where's your loyalty to the party?

Tony Abbott has been in the job for less than 7 days, he hasn't yet published a policy on this (it's been seven days cut him some slack) and he hasn't said once that what he may propose will cost nothing.

Tony said it may be revenue neutral. That's not the same thing, and to paraphrase you 'morever you know it'.

Honestly Malcolm, don't be a sore loser, just get on with the job and support your leader, or if you love the labor ETS so much – not even something they want to fully support at this point – go join them.
Craig
# Craig
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:24 AM
Sour grapes, Malcwarm Turnbull. Too bad you didn't get your way.

I see another bitter Paul Keating in the making.
Steven
# Steven
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:24 AM
Dear Malcolm .... It's not about you or your ego... Your disloyalty to the Liberal Party is outrageous but sadly not unexpected. Move on Malcolm.
Stephen
# Stephen
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:24 AM
Economic arguments in favour of an ETS:

1. Property held in common, for example a commune, will always be subject to the so-called "tragedy of the commons". eg, The story of farmers with cows grazing a common paddock: because there is no incentive not to overgraze, eventually, the entire paddock is ruined and cannot be used.

2. Of course, cutting emissions will cost. If the other forms of energy were cheaper, they would already be in use.

3. A carbon limit via an ETS and/or a carbon tax should be about managing the shift from a carbon intensive economy to one that isn't. In terms of cost, better a gradual shift than a sudden one.

4. Peak oil is already here.

5. Better to start now and be at the forefront with alternative technologies, and be in a position to export them, than to wait until its necessary to change, and then find out that it is cheaper to import everything. eg, solar, geothermal, etc.

6. That a rise in sea levels will have adverse economic effects cannot be denied. Some say the sea is not rising due to human causes. Plausible. But what if it were. Years from now, wouldn't it be better to be safe than sorry.
Paul
# Paul
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:25 AM
Bloody hell Malcolm, pull your head in or quit the party!!
mike_in_mudgee
# mike_in_mudgee
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:25 AM
Good stuff, Malcolm. Do not abandon the good fight! Abbott and his mob of nutters are not just climate change deniers, they are deniers of science in general and want science "put back in its rightful place" as Sarah Palin has said.
James
# James
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:26 AM
Malcolm you are a poor, sad, vindictive little man.
If Kevin and his party wear convinced of their convictions and their solution they would not have bothered negotiating with you or the Liberals.
Unlike Labor and your party the Greens don’t doubt climate change and are ready to take real action. If Rudd actually wanted useful legislation passed to would have negotiated with them. Instead he played you and won a monumental political victory- one which you are amplifying.
You, and the rest of the nation, got played and you’re too sour to see it.
Doron Katz
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:27 AM
Sorry you guys and Malcolm. You all make it a tab boo to discuss ETS and validity of human induced climate change. All Tony Abbott is asking for is a debate, and everyone is running saying No. Im sorry, I dont subscribe to the British Academic world of censorship and figure-manipulating when it comes to Global Warming.

Sorry Malcolm, you may have your view on this but you should talk for the party, or make your own party but we vote for parties as it stands in Australia, not a politician (unless you are an independent).
MartinGAtkins
# MartinGAtkins
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:27 AM
You were willing to support a tax that would ruin Australian industry and hurt every hard working tax payer. Your a gutless appeaser and the Liberal party would be better off without you.
Nathan
# Nathan
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:27 AM
Sorry "gerry", but I don't think you speak for "most Australians". Nor do I, but if we're going to play pretend, I believe "most Australians" will vote for George W Bush before they vote for Tony Abbott. The Liberals have just lost election 2010, and I think they know it.

The thing is, I think I'd like Mr Abbott if I met him in person. He seems a likeable bloke, and I seem to share many values with him. However, there are several vital things I believe vital to the future of Australia that he and I don't see eye-to-eye on.

As for Mr Turnbull, it's a pity the leaders of this country (and I think Mr Turnbull fell into this category until a week ago) are unable to speak plainly for fear of being torn apart by the media and their rivals. I would love to be in the room if they ever get together off-the-record and speak plainly what they think without fear of recrimination the next day.

Mr Howard was ousted as leader of the opposition in the 80's, and then went on to regain the leadership and become Prime Minister. I wouldn't be so quick to rule out Mr Turnbull just yet. He has shown himself to be a force in Australian politics that is not to be underestimated.
Chino
# Chino
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:28 AM
Malcom,

I applaud you.

Keep going.
George Pap
# George Pap
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:28 AM
Well said... the sound of sincerity.

You have said, what alot of people have not had the intelligence and guts to express.

Nick Minchin implied that most Australians are gullible, and that is why they accepted the premise of human induced global warming.

But how gullible do people want to be when they are willing to give Tony Abbott and Nick Minchin the benefit of the doubt and not our planet.

Good on you Malcolm dont let them silence you.
Brendan
# Brendan
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:29 AM
I would say that Abbott said before what he did to be loyal to the leader until that loyalty looked like destroying the party - so then he did the right thing and spoke what he really believed in.

Some people do have loyalty and don't go around bashing their leader and throwing temper tantrums.

Anyway, the bottom line is that the Liberals are stronger now and every day justifies the changes.
Aaron
# Aaron
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:29 AM
The Libs have really shot themselves in the foot here. Who would have thought they would elect a leader in 2009 even more backwards than John Howard.

I haven't voted Liberal for a decade or so but you were a fine Opposition leader Malcolm!

PS don't forget about the Republic thing eh?
derspatz
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:30 AM
Who are you REALLY working for Malcolm ? It certainly doesn't seem to be either the Liberal party or the good of Oz.

What REALLY is your interest in seeing Oz speedily enslaved to endless ETS that does absolutely nothing in terms of influencing the natural and endless cycle of climate change ?

Anyway, just like ten upon tens of thousands of email writers and blog posters/commentors (including myself) coupled with the recent tsunami news event of "Climategate' helped bring about the returning of the Liberal party to its necessary conservative roots by removing you as leader and the putting of a road-block on the highly suspect and totally unnecessary ETS, hopefully before too long concerned email writers of Oz will be able to convince the Liberal Party to get rid of you completely.

Then you can go back to working for Kevvy and Goldman Sachs ... oh hang on, did you ever CEASE being in the employ of both ?

In closing, never mind for a moment what your ETS was going to cost Oz ... I'm more interested in what it is going to cost you by NOT having it.

I say bring on a Royal Commission to not only explore the questionable science behind the whole AGW lie and ETS scam, but also to explore the potential vested interests of those who were pushing for it the most.

Such as you.

regarDS
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTGLpqFGyYM
Peter
# Peter
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:31 AM
Malcolm, I may be out of touch, but in talking to lots of small business people in rural Australia, I find a huge lack of understanding of the ETS and its impact. I also ask this question: Why did our forefathers go to war to protect our sovreignty when, via Kyooto, Via World Heritage Listings, we seem so keen hand over control of our nation to others, and who are these others? It is of great concern to me that we are so quick to adopt actions which appear to me to be almost traitor like.

John Howard said he would meet kyoto standards but would not sign the agreement - what was wrong with that?

We should act alone, not as part of an international group, but alone and in the best interests of Australia, and we should therefore be having an exhaustive debate around the costs of this plan, ETS, and the costs of other proposals. Governments have an appalling records in managing tax revenue - just look at the States in particular Queensland and NSW who are virtually basket cases when we have had some of the best economic times for the past hundred years during the last decade.How can we trust them to use the funds wisely, to encourage greener power, more efficient fuels. We don't trust them - they are a Labor Govt and they do not have any credentials to manage an economy.

Look at the waste that has occurred with the GFC handouts.Even if i believed in Global Warming, caused by humans, and I am somewhat skeptical, then I would not trust this Government to administer it in a fair way. Just look at the appointment for the vote rigging Mike Kaiser to his NBN position - what a joke.

There is a lot involved here, but I would not support any additional tax measures whilst Labor is in office.

Peter
Mac
# Mac
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:31 AM
“Play the ball, not the man”. Great straight talk on the ISSUE. Yes, it is going to cost something. We need to do something – the debate is good.

Also – why isn’t anyone use the whole ‘tipping point’ analogy of ecosystems. The human body is an ecosystem that reaches a tipping point of ‘death threat’ when you smoke, drink excessively etc etc. And increases when excessive amounts are done in a short space of time. Why don’t we use this issue based lobbying to educate further about the earth. We have stats on what CO2 our global industries are releasing – in the short space of the last 200 years of industrialised society – just do the stats on the growth of internet usage in the world and the CO2 released into the atmosphere – this one simple message with the tipping point analogy could quickly shift a few more liberal members’ understanding of this issue.

The Rudd Government are trying to resist the petty personal attacks of our parliament - and it is working - look at how the Liberals are imploding as the Rudd Govt are not getting sucked in by this bullying game. They have done a lot of good work on this issue – they need the bipartisan support – which you gave – keep focussed – you are a voice for many – keep going.

~ No put downs
~ No personal attacks
~ Rational arguments,
~ Focussed on the issue
~ Keep attempting to educate
~ Keep canvassing for different solutions if they don’t like this one.
Tim
# Tim
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:31 AM
Start your own climate party Mal. You could easily make it a very good alternative to the wacky green vote.
W Roberts
# W Roberts
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:31 AM
Why are we even discussing reducing our own emissions when there are no committments from China, India, USA and Europe.

Why penalise Australia with debts of Billions of Dollars when the changes we may make are so insignificant compared to emissions from theselarge emitters.
Scott
# Scott
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:32 AM
I agree with Boris, join the democrats, I am a member of the party, and if anyone can keep the bastards honest you can. It has the foundations there to build it back up as a dominate player in Australian Politics again.

Mark
# Mark
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:32 AM
Good work Malcolm,
Keep this issue front and centre - the young and future generations depend upon people like yourself pushing for action on climate change.
Sergio
# Sergio
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:32 AM
Malcolm

The Labor party people who will never vote Liberal are blowing smoke up your pompous rear end and giving you a false impression that you have clear support for your ETS policy folly.

True Liberal supporters can't accept that a new tax will save the environment when the proceeds go to pay off heavy polluters.

Do everyone a favour, quit the Liberal Party and go join your mates at the Labor Party.
barry
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:33 AM
Get over it, the party has made its choice.
Clovis
# Clovis
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:33 AM
Malcolm for senate! (Someone has to keep the b&$tards honest ; and its damaging to be associated with flat-earthers...) .
ben bhuy
# ben bhuy
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:33 AM
Well said MT. Keep up the fight, the future of the Liberal Party depends upon it.
Richard
# Richard
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:34 AM
Good on you Malcolm!

I am utterly shattered that you are no longer leader of the Federal Liberal Party and we are now seeing certain members of the party use the climate change debate as an excuse to go backwards and move towards the far right and become an ultra conservative movement.

But if you and any of your like minded progressive Liberals decide to form a new third force political movement you can count on my membership and support! We need and can have a political party which is pro-free market, pro-republic and wanting to still do something about our environment along with a degree of compassion on social issues.

This country needs people like you with conviction that are willing to stand up for what they believe in.

All the very best.
Michael Sukkar
# Michael Sukkar
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:34 AM
It's not surprising that Malcolm has chosen the scorched earth policy now that he's been dumped as leader. We have seen similar vindictive actions in much of Malcolm's public life whenever he doesn't get his way. Malcolm, remember that you are still a member of the Liberal Party and should refrain from making absurd statements that destabilise the Party. You have lost the policy debate, and your leadership style was rejected by the Parliamentary party, so I would suggest that as a "humble backbencher" you concentrate on the electorate of Wentworth, and nothing else.
Tim James
# Tim James
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:36 AM
Despite a well worded rant, I fear you're missing the point Malcolm. Many Australians believe something needs to be done. But we simply fail to see what the rush is, nor to we believe we should just nod politely when Rudd tells us he knows best.

To call me a climate change sceptic is an insult, I'm not sceptical that there's a problem, I'm sceptical that Rudd has the solution.

Why the rush? Why can't we at least wait until the rest of the world gets together and perhaps agrees on a general direction? We alone can't do a damn thing, so what's the point, other than ensuring Rudd eventually gets his nice UN posting?
Colin
# Colin
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:37 AM
Malcolm, how about you come clean on the REAL reason you are so determined to impose an ETS on Australia?

How about you come clean on your former Chairmanship and Partnership with carbon derivatives trading prime mover, Goldman Sachs?

For that matter, how about you come clean on your own and fellow Goldmanite Chris Joye's lobbying of the Government, in 2002-03, via your then Chairmanship of the Menzies Research Centre, advocating for deregulation and encouragement of equity financing and other financial "innovations" to boost the availability of easy finance in the mortgage market, thus making a financial killing for you and your Goldman mates, whilst average Australians have been crucified by ever-rising house prices, and record household debt levels?

Your cynical, self-serving advocacy for Goldman Sachs' continued rape and pillage of the masses is shameful, if not arguably evil. It WILL be exposed.

What bets this post is rejected? The truth will out, Malcolm.
Paul
# Paul
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:39 AM
Well said. You are way too worthy for the liberal party.
DaveK
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:39 AM
Well said. On his first appearance on 7.30 Report as Leader, Abbot had some of his words quoted back at him and he responded that he only said that because he was supporting his leader. In other words he lies for political advantage. I don't know how anyone could vote for him after that.

Unfortunately your integrity, the numbers in the party room don't stack up. Rather than continuing to attack the party leadership from the back benches, you should resign and move to the cross benches. If you were to be followed by others, you could then form a new party which could wield considerable influence in the Senate, and may displace the Liberal Party altogether.

I hope you do.
anonymous
# anonymous
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:39 AM
mate - you just lost my vote for the seat of Wentworth!!
James
# James
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:42 AM
Well said. If politicians stopped trying to out do each other and actually sat down and talked about the issues that are facing Australia, regardless of their allegiances, Australia would be a much better place. Mr Turnbull you are the one of the first to do so and I beleive you truly are one of the great politicians this nation has seen. If only others from either side of the bench could behave the same way. I am neither a Labor or Liberal supporter, but I am a supporter of Australia.
John
# John
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:43 AM
Malcolm you are an AL GORE belierver and you are wrong , the world is getting cooler (latest findings) and I feel you all have been dupped ,conned,and yes bullshitted to. Malcolm wake up !you supposed to be a learned man (not a sheep),sit back and wait till the truth comes out.

Global warming is NOT happening !

Steven Cousley
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:44 AM
It's nice to see the honesty Malcolm. Please keep it up for the good of the people you represent and the country as a whole. Living in a rural area I can already see the costs of doing nothing on climate change. Yes there must be costs involved in dealing this issue. The long term results of doing nothing will cost a whole lot more. Abbotts stance on this issue is ridiculous.
Andy Semple
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:45 AM
Hey Malcolm, no upside for you or your party if you now continue to be a sore loser. The enemy is Kevin Rudd, not your own party. The mind boggles why you and others within the party are so keen to help that megalomaniac Prime Minister of ours. What team are you really playing on anyway? The ETS is like cancer and once it is in our economy you would never be able to get rid of it. Regardless of your amendments, the ETS is still a pig. I also suppose you don’t put much weight in the recent “Climategate” email scandal – which just further proves the science isn’t settled and in fact has been manipulated by the climate alarmists - like you.

I’d have had some more respect of you had you instead been advocating say a straight out carbon tax– at least then you could argue how crap an ETS is whereas at least a carbon tax is transparent, but no, you had to support Kevin Rudd. Not only that, you where given a chance to save your leadership but your ego got in the way so you reap what you sow, Malcolm. If you can’t contribute and sing from the same song sheet, do the noble thing and resign your seat. Any goodwill that was left will quickly erode away if you now snipe away at your colleagues from the sidelines.
alyson emmins
# alyson emmins
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:45 AM
Go Malcolm! Keep it up: there was only one bloody vote in it! Just wait...
The citizens have to wait again for sensible informed debate.
All the best.
Kim
# Kim
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:47 AM
Keep it up Malcolm.

I'm glad to see someone within the Liberal party is keeping up the debate.
This issue is too big to be ignored for another decade or become a partisan issue.

Suggestions:

If the National Party does not believe in GW, stop drought relief.

Any member of parliament over 60 should be ineligible to vote on the issue. It's easier for them to bet against GW - they're not going to be around when the worst happens.
Greg Wootton
# Greg Wootton
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:47 AM
Ah Malcolm,

You were a very poor leader and this outburst shows that you are used to getting your own way.

If your policy had stayed it would have been a bloodbath at the weekend. Leave politics and go back running a company, your King Mal approach is accepted there.
Martin
# Martin
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:47 AM
Good on you, Malcolm.

Nice to get a glimpse of the Liberals as a party of rationality, before what may be a long trip into the wilderness...
Paul M
# Paul M
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:47 AM
What would be the thing to do is for the Coalition parties to regroup as Liberals and Conservatives, and let Australians tell them whose ideas they really support. The Liberals would take up the middle ground, which has been the property of Labor in recent years. The Conservatives, over time would contract to an ultra right wing party that few modern Australians would support.
Michael
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:48 AM
What an ego! Malcolm what we need is an informed debate. Your mistake is that you were fooled by Kevin Rudd into supporting the need for a hasty decision on a poorly explained system. No one doubts your climate change beliefs but you've had your time. Either shut up or quit the Liberal Party.
Hopenhagen
# Hopenhagen
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:52 AM
For all those INTERESTED in a POSITIVE outcome from the Copenhagen meeting , the United Nations have a web site and facebook page blog etc.
"" H O P E N H A G E N ""
http://www.hopenhagen.org/

Climate sceptics , as you were , heads in sand this its just a media beat up with EVERY world leader attending to discuss the topic that aBBOT and the secptics are advocating does not exist .

********** WELL DONE MALCOLM ************ spot ON
41 / 42 could be interesting if this is given a good coverage.
David Suzuki and many others have been reporting on man made the climate problems for 20 years . At a time when we all need an honest political approach we have 7 sceptics with loud voices and the flat earth brigade being followed by some very weak MP'S in the Liberal party .


John
# John
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:53 AM
Malcolm,
When Abbott and the Minchinite Liberal Party lose the next election, you should have another tilt at the leadership.
The opportunity might even come sooner. Let's see how Abbott fares in the polls over the next six months.
fehowarth
# fehowarth
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:54 AM
Public opinion is not always right. This so call opinion can also change. Mr. Abbott and his ilk set the ground rules for the future. They cannot deny others what they claimed for themselves the right to speak out. I have no brief for Mr. Turnbull but in this case he maybe right. Give Mr. Abbott time and he will put his foot into it by making comments as in the past, but people for the time being and listening to him. There appears to be no loyalty or morality in the modern fay Coalition. Anything goes as long as you have the strength and are willing to bully.
Matt Holden
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:54 AM
Hear, hear, Malcolm. If only Kevin Rudd could explain the issue so succinctly and clearly. It’s time the people who want to take action on climate change weren’t afraid to spell out the costs of action -- and the costs of inaction. Rudd -- or whoever is going to do something about this -- needs to be up-front and honest and not take people for idiots. As for Abbott, I don’t think anyone can take him seriously on this issue -- without some kind of market mechanism -- tax or trading scheme -- he is left with a very Big Government approach as his only option, including, presumably, foisting nuclear power on Labor electorates close to existing power generation infrastructure (I am thinking the Latrobe Valley, for example). That or fiddling at the edges and waiting for someone else to do something ... Keep it up --
Colin North
# Colin North
Monday, December 07, 2009 11:54 AM
Your title was great. Then you proceeded to choke discussion. Australians are not sceptics, they just need to understand the problem and the options.

Rather than tearing your political party to pieces. Contribute to the discussion. Too much is written obout the characteristics of the players rather than the issue(s) at hand.

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